Maestro-
I’d say Bennett is doing better than ‘a little more’ w/ less.
SMC is simply not that talented, less so than USF, us and BYU and yet they are in good position to make the tourney. That speaks volumes IMO. And he has done it before including when they were on probation with scholarship and recruiting restrictions he still managed to piece together squads that were successful and top 3 in league.
Likewise, look what Kyle Smith and now Todd Golden have done with USF. A program in more or less the same situation as SCU but they’ve had more success than Sendek and have done so w/ notably less resources…neither Smith or Golden were/are making anywhere near Sendek’s $1.3M nor do they have the practice facility we have.
Like you, I also like this team. But as I and BB noted, this may be the peak…a veteran team, no shortage of experience, a special talent in Jalen but Vrankic and Pipes will gone after this year and who knows if Jalen and Justice will return. This could be the near-term peak for a Sendek led squad in terms of the combination of talent and experience you generally need to be successful. If this is the peak, is that enough for you? What if we don’t even make the NIT, would you still be satisfied?
If Jalen and/or Justice don’t return, then despite some promising young guys, it would make for a pretty young and inexperienced team and then we’re back in rebuilding, ‘wait til next year’ mode, hoping for maybe an 18win season and waiting for the stars to align again with the right mix of talent and experience.
Six years in and an “I hope this really talented squad gets into the NIT” attitude just doesn’t do it for me.
Some people are satisfied with mediocrity or less. I’m just not wired that way.
To say Bennett is doing a little more with a little less shows your personal bias… to think the 2 are even remotely comparable is asinine. Bennett is light years beyond Sendek… Golden is too for that matter.
I think it is too early to call it a “peak” when we have zero clue what the roster will look like next year. If Wiliams goes pro and Justice opts for something else then we are most likely looking at a rebuild unless we get multiple high impact transfers. If both of those guys return and you throw in one high impact transfer then we should be an NCAA tournament team. Braun moves to the wing where he is best suited. Bediako plays the 5 and you get more development from your freshman forwards plus hopefully a strong interior defender transfer. Stewart begins to breakout as a star and hopefully Knapper and Emsinger give you productive depth. I agree that us taking the next step as a program is on the defensive side of the ball. That is why we are not in the NCAA tournament and St Mary’s and USF are. We are ahead of them both in offensive metrics but they both defend at a Top 25 level while we are 137th in Defense.
True, we don’t know what next year will look like. That said, this is certainly the zenith for Herb’s 6 seasons at SCU. For me it’s simply not high enough.
Fair enough. Bennett, not just this year, but in general, is an incredibly successful coach. I didn’t intend to imply that he’s not. His resume speaks for itself. Golden I’m less sold on, for now anyway.
I also think that had we not had that mono situation in December we are likely firmly on the bubble too, and it’s not the same discussion.
It’s not that I’m or anyone is satisfied with mediocrity, but in his time we’ve got better, and until I see it’s this zenith for sure and we start backsliding, I think he deserves a chance to keep building something. I’d like to think there’s more ahead.
Full disclosure I’m a Gonzaga grad. I got my master’s degree at SCU soon after, and stayed in the area. Over time I became a fan after going to so many games with my family. For what it’s worth a lot of Santa Clara alums told me back in 2001 that Gonzaga was at its zenith. Sweet 16 with Santangelo, Calvary, and Frahm (two seniors and a junior) was the ceiling.
Bettererer, Enjoy and concur with thoughts on mbb… My Sources say, Dr Gloom overthinks the everything including the minutia and then becomes indecisive. He’s obviously smart, perhaps too smart. However, he’s caught in a time warp and can’t adapt, relate nor motivate today’s players. We have some very good players, yet they play without emotion, emulating their coach’s personality. After six years of Herb, it’s time to send him on his way since we’re no further along than we were with KK. We spend a boatload of money on mbb for mediocre results. However, I don’t think Renee will pull the plug and send Herb on his way. But then I keep singing, “Please Walk Away Renee”. I could say more but will hold back since the Athletic Dept is in enough chaos and understaffed as it is. People leave (let go), but aren’t replaced. Beyond the AEC, nothing has changed with our athletic teams. Our only NCAA winners are in soccer with Jerry Smith and Cameron Rast and both are institutions on campus which Renee cannot take any credit. In addition, she wanted to move on, but didn’t get the job at Boise State. Our Athletic Blueprint for success isn’t working and she probably saw there was nothing more she could do. So, I say goodbye. Time to move on before we get stuck in another 25 yrs of mediocrity…
This is probably Renee’s last chance to un-tether her time at SCU to Herb. She does seem rather self-serving, so perhaps she cuts the cord in an attempt to lengthen her time as AD?
Way too early to fret about next year- especially with the new transfer rules. Remember that we got both Pipes and Braun there. Without those guys it could have been a long season. I have a few gripes with Herb, but I really like watching this team.
I’m focused on this year but taking a glimpse towards next year provides context for this year…the time is now…2 starters will definitely be gone, and 2 others 50/50 they’ll be back including a special talent in Jalen. Yes, we could backfill with transfers but getting 4 impact transfers of the caliber of guys we may lose isn’t likely.
Win now, the future is not guaranteed!
The “do we fire Herb” conversation is pretty old at this point. He’s 58, he’s been here for 6 years, and can we do better.
I’m agnostic, i’ve enjoyed this season because its our best in 9 years and i think the most nationally relevant in 20 years.
He has done better over the past 3 seasons statistically, he is clearly better than KK.
YEAR
Total Ranking
Offense Ranking
Defensive Ranking
Coach
2008
158
221
95
KK
2009
139
189
110
KK
2010
237
263
195
KK
2011
117
90
117
KK
2012
253
138
325
KK
2013
72
52
126
KK
2014
157
131
199
KK
2015
153
116
202
KK
2016
230
210
237
KK
2017
112
122
119
HS
2018
274
265
267
HS
2019
190
236
150
HS
2020
136
168
133
HS
2021
132
187
107
HS
2022
80
36
138
HS
Total Average
162.6666667
161.6
168
KK Average
168.4
156.6
178.4
HS Average
154
169
152.3
Total Median
153
168
138
KK Median
194
215.5
166
HS Median
134
177.5
135.5
I’m off work and done some rudimentary data analysis that i think shows that Herb is better. Are these numbers “good” or worthy of an extension? I don’t know!
I don’t think that the question has ever been “is HS better than KK?”…I think we can all agree that HS is indeed much better than KK. The real question is “can we do better?”. I’d like to think so. But it will require the university administration to really commit to the process. I just don’t see the school doing what Gonzaga did a quarter century ago…primarily because SCU doesn’t NEED to do so. The school as a whole is doing just fine, with or without basketball.
EDITED to add: I also think that the school will never make a quantum leap forward with the current AD at the helm.
I think that’s probably fair. USF has clearly been ahead of us over the past 5 years or so (per Torvik) and I think they are the benchmark of what is possible in the WCC.
Also, imagine how the WCC would be different if the Dons hadn’t death penaltyed themselves in the 80s!
If a more emotional coach can get us to the next level, Renee and the Bronco brain trust should keep an eye on Juwan Howard. He might be available in the near future, and he’s emotional.
As a recent Michigan grad, I definitely winced seeing that. Awful, awful look.
I’m in the pro-Herb contingent for the moment if the team can finish strong. But long-term, I’m also awaiting the day that Lloyd Pierce returns to the Mission Campus. He would certainly be a less monotone and pacific presence than Herb.
Lloyd landed on his feet just fine, now as the top assistant under Rick Carlisle for the Indiana Pacers. Carlisle is one of the most respected coaches in the NBA so a good situation for Lloyd.
I expect Lloyd will get a 2nd chance at an NBA head coaching gig in the next 2-3 years. As much as I’d love to see Lloyd return to SCU, I think the NBA opportunities may stand in the way.
Jeez, that offensive ranking of 36 really stands out. No wonder they’re so fun to watch this year. Herb also has a nice trend line for the team’s overall ranking. The question is: Can he keep it going?