2025 Bracketology

We’re at that point of the season where we see projections. Here is one example. Please note that Thursday and Saturday games are not reflected.

Source: DRatings
Date: 01/14/25

NCAA:

Gonzaga…#3 seed
St. Mary’s… #9 seed

NIT: (32 teams)

USF…#4 seed (Home Game)
SCU…#5 seed
Wash St…#6 seed
Oregon St…#7 seed

We will definitely see movement especially with GU dropping. It will be interesting to see where Broncos are with next update and unexpected split. Expect SCU win @ GU to trump loss @ LMU.

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Here is the most recent NET ranking for our conference:

You’ll see that the top 5 in our conference are within the top 68 of NET ranking. #60 OSU has a single Quad 3 loss. And #78 Wazzu’s on blemish is a single Quad 4 loss. We are the only team with multiple Quad 3+4 losses.

I’m surprised that Gonzaga only dropped one spot after losing to us on their home court.

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Highlighting the three Q 3 losses is spot on and key……what could have been.
Flip that to 3-1 if not 4-0 (they were all one possession losses) and things look much different……that would probably translate to Top 40 Net and in the conversation as a bubble team. And that’s not even counting the USF OT loss (a regulation FT from winning) and the very winnable ASU and UW games. Frustrating……but we are we are; now have to focus on trying to be Top 2 in WCC regular season and winning the WCC tourney,

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Sticking with the theme of finishing Top 2…seems that we would want SMC to beat USF this next game.

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Torvik has a teamcast tool where you can fill in results for future games and then it spits out a projected seed (or miss the tournament). I played around with it to see what would be required for the Broncos to make the NCAA tournament as an at-large. The most realistic path (although admittedly still very low probability ) is to Win out in the regular season with the exception of a loss on the road against St Mary’s…then win one game in the WCC tournament against someone ( like OSU, USF, WSU, Gonzaga) and lose to St. Mary’s again in the Tournament. If the Broncos do all that, Torvik shows an 11 seed. Unlikely but not Impossible.

Link to the scenario I plugged in.

Santa Clara Torvik Teamcast Scenario - NCAA Tournament

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What’s as important as the wins themselves at this point are the losses already accumulated. Obvious, I know, but here’s what I really mean: The quad system is only relevant after the final game. It’s all tentative until then, so some lucky breaks in the numbers might yet help SCU.

One of the Q3 losses is likely to flip to Q2. That’s Stanford, especially after they upset UNC on Saturday in Chapel Hill. Stanford is just barely outside the top-75. Need them to pick up another decent ACC win to flip inside the top-75. Then that’s one Q3 loss eliminated.

But then you still have to convert one of the others to Q2. Maybe LMU does it now that they can play some of the lesser WCC squads. They have to jump 20 spots, though. That’s easier in the mid-100s, but the NET is getting sticky at this point in the season. NDSU has almost no chance of getting to top-75. They’ve done SCU a massive favor by being as high as they are so as not to be a catastrophic Q4 loss.

Washington is inside the top-100, which means Q2, but they could spiral at any moment.

Oh and Wazzu is now Q3 at home. So they cannot lose the next game. Even the theoretical chances evaporate then.

All of which is to say, each loss is like doubling down on the roulette wheel. Every time you lose, you stake yet another all-in bet on red or black. Sure, you could get five straight. But we are dealing with theoretical possibilities now. I think @getnashty joked a few weeks ago that we were at that point of the season where we bargain over the possibility of 11-game winning streaks.

I was actually a little optimistic up until the LMU loss. I saw the Stanford loss flipping to Q2, leaving SCU with only one bad resume loss. But then the stinker at LMU meant one more double-down at roulette, and the odds once again look much too remote to focus on.

Go 3-0 over the next set (while rooting hard for the Cardinal and LMU Lions), and maybe there’s some reevaluation. But you want your resume to be in your control as much as possible, and that’s just not at all what SCU has created for itself this season.

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Gonzaga dropped more than 1 spot as the NET rankings are updated daily I believe. We dropped like 5 spots when we lost to LMU and then went up 8 spots when we beat Gonzaga. I believe yesterday’s net ranking showed Gonzaga dropping at least 6 or more spots after losing to the Broncos.

I’m seeing a drop from 18 to 19

That’s from the official NCAA NET ranking page

Also, remember that the NCAA Selection Committee claims (though query how much to believe them) that the NET is a resume tool, not a ranking tool. So a given team’s NET doesn’t matter when evaluating that team. Rather, the NET sorts the teams your team has played for resume purposes. So SCU’s KenPom ranking and WAB on Torvik, in theory, matter more than the Broncos’ NET positioning. But LMU and Stanford’s NET is very relevant to SCU as determining their final resume.

Bottom line: we need to win the WCC tourney, or we need to win out AND get to the championship game AND hope that some of our Q3 losses become Q2 losses

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Yes I know. They update daily. Yesterday official NCAA NET showed Gonzaga drop from 12 to 18. And then today they dropped 1pt further from 18 to 19 probably from other Sunday games. If you look at Santa Clara they didn’t move in todays ranking they stayed at 62 as yesterdays ranking took into account the win over Gonzaga and moved us from 70 to 62 but today we stayed the same.

Stanford stole a win in Chapel Hill while we were battling in Spokane, so that helps.

I’m not going to be mad that we scheduled aggressively, it’s the narrow, last second losses (and collapses) that frustrate me. This team is so close.

I hope we play well and learn a lot, with a top 4 seed in the WCC Tourney and momentum by the time the regular season ends. It’s the only full-proof way to get in, and we’ve got a chance.

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Source: DRatings
Date: 01/21/25

NCAA:

Gonzaga…#5 Seed…Down 2 Lines
St. Mary’s…#9 Seed…No Change

NIT:

SCU…#4 Seed…Up 1 (Home Game)
USF…#5 Seed…Down 1 Line
Wash St…#7 Seed…Down 1 Line
Oregon St #7 Seed…No Change

Source: DRatings
Date: 01/28/25

NCAA:

Gonzaga…#5 Seed
St. Mary’s…#8 Seed (Up 1 line)

NIT:

Santa Clara…#4 Seed (Home Game)
USF…#5 Seed
Oregon St…#5 Seed (Up 2 lines)
Wash St…#8 Seed (Last team in)

Note: We’re firmly in the NIT field at the moment, which is not our goal. Keep in mind the NIT no longer allows an automatic bid for the smaller conference champions that fail to win their conference tournament.

Also projected in NIT field:

Arizona St…#4 Seed (Loss)
Stanford…#5 Seed (Loss)
Bradley…#5 Seed (Win)
Nevada…#8 Seed (Loss)

I’ve seen Arizona State closer to first four out by most bracketologists. Interesting.

First off, who wants to even play in the NIT?
Secondly, no way would they take 4 WCC teams in their 32 team field.
Thirdly, NIT is going the way of the WCC… will be completely gone within 5 years.

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While it’s not the goal, I still like playing in the NIT. Unless we ever make the NCAA tournament again, I’m not going to complain about “only” making the NIT. Sure beats the hell out of the lower pay to play tournaments.

It’s just a projection. I’m sure everyone on this board is well aware that things will probably change and that 4 WCC teams is unlikely.

The NCAA and ESPN recently signed an 8 year deal to broadcast the NIT. It’s not going anywhere anytime soon. The only thing that might change is how many more slots they start forcing the power conferences to take.

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Starting this year there’s a new 16 team postseason tourney in Vegas put together by Fox & AEG. The College Basketball Crown will feature teams from the Big Ten, Big East, Big 12 and some at large teams. This could possibly open up more spots for mid-major teams in the NIT.

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Yeah, well the NCAA is not likely to be around for those 8 years… and if they somehow are still a thing when all the majors skip out on the NCAA, I doubt anyone would want to watch the left overs that they could pick from.

Also, that College Basketball Crown is just those majors getting their toes wet before they jump ship

I could see power conf football somehow separating from the NCAA, but basketball is less likely IMO. It’s all about media $ and I can’t see CBS/Paramount risking messing too much with the success of March madness with much of the interest and excitement being mid-majors and small schools upsetting power conf teams and the stories/narratives of individual players from those teams.
If it pivots to power conf only, no one will care if a .500 Rutgers team ‘upsets’ a barely above .500 South Carolina…that’s effectively what the NIT games are today. I’d think the media types controlling the $$$ are smart enough to understand that.
Just my opinion…I could be completely wrong…time will tell.

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